1. Bishop Bannon--if no one goes to hell why is it so bad?
2. Denial of the DOCTRINE of Limbo. Yes. I said DOCTRINE.
If there is no Limbo then all of these children go to heaven and their mothers and fathers can repent later.
According to the Council of Lyons and Florence anyone dying in only Original Sin immediately goes to hell-- but of a different punishment. The punishment was always the theological debate, NOT Limbo's existence.
Council of Lyons II “…The souls of those who die in mortal sin or with ORIGINAL SIN ONLY, HOWEVER, IMMEDIATELY DESCEND TO HELL, TO BE PUNISHED WITH DIFFERENT PUNISHMENTS…-- (Denzinger 464)
Council of Florence: “…Moreover, the souls of those who depart in actual mortal sin or IN ORIGINAL SIN ONLY, DESCEND IMMEDIATELY INTO HELL BUT TO UNDERGO PUNISHMENTS OF DIFFERENT KINDS.— (Denzinger 693)
Augustine and many others said that infants that die before baptism suffer mild torment. While Aquinas and most since Aquinas said that they suffered the loss of the Beatific vision.
Also if Limbo is not a doctrine then how could Augustine write:
St. Augustine, Letter to Jerome, 415:
Also if Limbo is not a doctrine then how could Augustine write:
St. Augustine, Letter to Jerome, 415:
“Anyone who would say that even
infants who pass from this life without participation in the Sacrament
[of Baptism] shall be made alive in Christ TRULY GOES COUNTER TO THE
PREACHING OF THE APOSTLE AND CONDEMNS THE WHOLE CHURCH, where there is
great haste in baptizing infants because it is believed without doubt
that there is no other way at all in which they can be made alive in
Christ.” (Faith of the Early Fathers, Vol. 3:1439)
So to deny Limbo is to deny the Apostolic Faith. This is what Augustine taught.
So to deny Limbo is to deny the Apostolic Faith. This is what Augustine taught.
How is it people use Aquinas against us for denying BoD, but at the same time reject Limbo, which Aquinas held, with Augustine? And if Aquinas accepted Limbo then he must have thought Baptism was necessary for salvation, as did Augustine in his later years after rethinking his position on BoD after the Pelagian heresy.
This is why the council Council of Florence, Pope Eugene IV, Session 11, Feb. 4, 1442, taught de fide:
“Regarding children, indeed, because of danger of death, which can often take place, WHEN NO HELP CAN BE BROUGHT TO THEM BY ANOTHER REMEDY than through the sacrament of baptism, through which they are snatched from the domination of the Devil [original sin] and adopted among the sons of God, it advises that holy baptism ought not be deferred for forty or eighty days, or any time according to the observance of certain people…” (Denz. 712)
Don't you see the evil of abortion? If Aquinas is right and it is the highest part of hell and the only thing they suffer is the loss of the beatific vision, living a natural paradise, BUT still excluded from seeing God. This is even graver than murder, which can only deprive one of life, but abortion deprives them of eternal life. If Augustine is correct then they sentence their offspring to an eternity of torment.
Either way it is a scandal and horrific crime.
Pope Martin V, Council of Constance, Session 15, July 6, 1415 - Condemning the articles of John Wyclif - Proposition 6:
“Those who claim that the children of the faithful dying without sacramental baptism will not be saved, are stupid and presumptuous in saying this.”- CONDEMNED (Decrees of the Ecumenical Councils, Vol. 1, p. 422.)
(Unfortunately, this proposition is not found in Denzinger, John Wyclif was anathematized for this assertion.)
This is why the council Council of Florence, Pope Eugene IV, Session 11, Feb. 4, 1442, taught de fide:
“Regarding children, indeed, because of danger of death, which can often take place, WHEN NO HELP CAN BE BROUGHT TO THEM BY ANOTHER REMEDY than through the sacrament of baptism, through which they are snatched from the domination of the Devil [original sin] and adopted among the sons of God, it advises that holy baptism ought not be deferred for forty or eighty days, or any time according to the observance of certain people…” (Denz. 712)
Don't you see the evil of abortion? If Aquinas is right and it is the highest part of hell and the only thing they suffer is the loss of the beatific vision, living a natural paradise, BUT still excluded from seeing God. This is even graver than murder, which can only deprive one of life, but abortion deprives them of eternal life. If Augustine is correct then they sentence their offspring to an eternity of torment.
Either way it is a scandal and horrific crime.
Pope Martin V, Council of Constance, Session 15, July 6, 1415 - Condemning the articles of John Wyclif - Proposition 6:
“Those who claim that the children of the faithful dying without sacramental baptism will not be saved, are stupid and presumptuous in saying this.”- CONDEMNED (Decrees of the Ecumenical Councils, Vol. 1, p. 422.)
(Unfortunately, this proposition is not found in Denzinger, John Wyclif was anathematized for this assertion.)
Pope St. Siricius, 385, [Concerning the necessity of baptism] :
“Therefore just as we declare that respect for the Easter sacrifice [Paschal time] should not be lessened in the case of any person, in like manner we wish help to be brought WITH ALL SPEED TO CHILDREN WHO BECAUSE OF THEIR AGE CANNOT YET SPEAK, AND TO THOSE WHO IN ANY EMERGENCY ARE IN NEED OF THE WATER OF HOLY BAPTISM, lest it should lead to the destruction of our souls IF, BY REFUSING THE WATER OF SALVATION TO THOSE WHO DESIRE IT, EACH OF THEM, WHEN TAKING LEAVE OF THIS WORLD, SHOULD LOSE BOTH THE KINGDOM AND LIFE. Indeed whoever suffers the peril of shipwreck, an enemy attack, the danger of siege or desperation resulting from some bodily infirmity, and so asks for what in their faith is their only help, let them receive at the moment of their request the reward of regeneration [sacramental baptism] that they beg for. This much should suffice for my digression on this subject; now let all priests who do not wish to be wrenched from the firmly-fixed rock of the apostles, on which Christ built his universal church, hold fast to the aforesaid rule.” (Latin found in Denzinger-Schonmetzer, Latin Edition, 1962, no. 184; an English Translation found in The Christian Faith, Sixth Revised and Enlarged Edition, Staten Island, NY: Alba House, 1996, p. 540.)
Pope Sixtus V in his Constitution Effrænatam (1588) on abortion:
“For who would not detest a crime as execrable as this — a crime whose consequence is that not just bodies, but — still worse! — even souls, are, as it were, cast away? The soul of the unborn infant bears the imprint of God's image! It is a soul for whose redemption Christ our Lord shed His precious blood, a soul capable of eternal blessedness and destined for the company of angels! WHO, THEREFORE, WOULD NOT CONDEMN AND PUNISH WITH THE UTMOST SEVERITY THE DESECRATION COMMITTED BY ONE WHO HAS EXCLUDED SUCH A SOUL FROM THE BLESSED VISION OF GOD? Such a one has done all he or she could possibly have done to prevent this soul from reaching the place prepared for it in heaven, and has deprived God of the service of this His own creature.”
(also not in the Denzinger)
“For who would not detest a crime as execrable as this — a crime whose consequence is that not just bodies, but — still worse! — even souls, are, as it were, cast away? The soul of the unborn infant bears the imprint of God's image! It is a soul for whose redemption Christ our Lord shed His precious blood, a soul capable of eternal blessedness and destined for the company of angels! WHO, THEREFORE, WOULD NOT CONDEMN AND PUNISH WITH THE UTMOST SEVERITY THE DESECRATION COMMITTED BY ONE WHO HAS EXCLUDED SUCH A SOUL FROM THE BLESSED VISION OF GOD? Such a one has done all he or she could possibly have done to prevent this soul from reaching the place prepared for it in heaven, and has deprived God of the service of this His own creature.”
(also not in the Denzinger)
And
this doctrine was held all the ways until the 1950's when there was an
attack on this doctrine by Modernists. They said it was "a theory."
The Holy Office (now the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith) in 1958 provided as follows:
The Holy Office (now the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith) in 1958 provided as follows:
"The practice has arisen in some places of
delaying the conferring of Baptism for so-called reasons of
convenience or of a liturgical nature--a practice favored by some
opinions, lacking solid foundation, concerning the eternal salvation
of infants who die without Baptism.
Therefore this Supreme Congregation, with the approval of the Holy Father, warns the faithful that infants are to be baptized as soon as possible. . . . Pastors and preachers are exhorted to urge the fulfillment of this obligation." (Apostolicae Sedis, L, 114)
Unfortunately many have been duped at the expense of children's souls.
Therefore this Supreme Congregation, with the approval of the Holy Father, warns the faithful that infants are to be baptized as soon as possible. . . . Pastors and preachers are exhorted to urge the fulfillment of this obligation." (Apostolicae Sedis, L, 114)
Unfortunately many have been duped at the expense of children's souls.
